A lot of things in the anime version are quite silly compared with the manga. The puzzle breaking is just one of the many things that look so much logical only in the manga. But the first place in my list of illogical things in the anime version goes to the entire "lack of blood" thing, even when the presence of blood is necessary for a certain scene in order to look logically true and reliable.
Just remeber the "Discover Pharaoh" and "A receptacle of a white dragon" manga chapters and then compare it with the anime version in episode 208. In the manga scene the Pharaoh wakes up seriously injured in a cave with blood all over his face and his right arm, if I'm correct. In the anime version he woke up only slightly bruised. O_o
Well now tell me, will you be only slightly bruised if you have just fallen in a huge precipice? O_o - OF COURSE NOT! It's true that Atem's survival after this is a miracle and we don't actually know how he got in that cave in a first place (probably Hasan helped him), but even with these vaguenesses, the anime version of this scene remains absolutely silly and unacceptable. Not to mention there are many more "lack of blood" examples. O_o

Originally Posted by Lia

A lot of things in the anime version are quite silly compared with the manga. The puzzle breaking is just one of the many things that look so much logical only in the manga. But the first place in my list of illogical things in the anime version goes to the entire "lack of blood" thing, even when the presence of blood is necessary for a certain scene in order to look logically true and reliable.
Just remeber the "Discover Pharaoh" and "A receptacle of a white dragon" manga chapters and then compare it with the anime version in episode 208. In the manga scene the Pharaoh wakes up seriously injured in a cave with blood all over his face and his right arm, if I'm correct. In the anime version he woke up only slightly bruised. O_o
Well now tell me, will you be only slightly bruised if you have just fallen in a huge precipice? O_o - OF COURSE NOT! It's true that Atem's survival after this is a miracle and we don't actually know how he got in that cave in a first place (probably Hasan helped him), but even with these vaguenesses, the anime version of this scene remains absolutely silly and unacceptable. Not to mention there are many more "lack of blood" examples. O_o

Then I guess people are a little misinformed when they say Yugioh is not a series with a lot of blood in it. And speaking of things that were modified, the first series has a similar example. In Monster World, when they blow off Zork's left hand (that's right kids, blow off, not injure), the anime only shows part of the skin of his arm having been torn off. Also, in the chapter when Yuugi played an arcade game, kept winning against a man and the man got angry, beat him up and stole his puzzle, the way they handled Jonouchi confronting the man afterwards in the anime was also different. No knife fight with Jonouchi getting a cut on his face.

And the scenes in the pharaoh's memory world are the ones that I would have thought of first since they do have quite a bit more blood. Yes, I do recall that in the manga, when he fell from that height, Atem when he woke up had bloody injuries all over, and a little later on, even had difficulty walking and was nursing his right arm. But nevermind that, he would also take injury and spit blood whenever one of the gods or Mahad's spirit would be injured or destroyed. The anime seemed to undermine the severeness of his injuries and just how close he came to dying time after time.

The puzzle thing bothered me a little more because of how glaringly stupid it was though. Also because I *hate* the way Otogi is introduced in the anime and that he didn't get to play the bigger part that he does in the manga.

Then I guess people are a little misinformed when they say Yugioh is not a series with a lot of blood in it. And speaking of things that were modified, the first series has a similar example. In Monster World, when they blow off Zork's left hand (that's right kids, blow off, not injure), the anime only shows part of the skin of his arm having been torn off. Also, in the chapter when Yuugi played an arcade game, kept winning against a man and the man got angry, beat him up and stole his puzzle, the way they handled Jonouchi confronting the man afterwards in the anime was also different. No knife fight with Jonouchi getting a cut on his face.

Another greater illogical thing in the anime version is also the meeting with Bobasa. The anime so much ruined the interesting part about this guy. T_T Nowhere in the anime is mentioned that Bobasa is actually Shadi's servant - not just a key switch, haunting the Pharah's Memory World, that can lead the characters to where the Pharaoh's name is if thy give him enough food to eat. Nor even his slots of all the millenium items on his stomach were shown. T_T Also in the manga, he is actually Hassan, while they are different people in the anime. (If I'm correct about this fact though!?) The writers definitely made big mistake by depersonalizing Bobasa's character and when they belittled his role in the storyline.

The puzzle thing bothered me a little more because of how glaringly stupid it was though. Also because I *hate* the way Otogi is introduced in the anime and that he didn't get to play the bigger part that he does in the manga.

Yes, it would have been far more interesting if the anime made clear that the stealing and the breaking of the puzzle along with the fire where Yugi had to solve the puzzle again were all created by Otogi's father who wanted revenge for the battle he lost agains Yugi's gradfather in the past. I guess the writers compensated Otogi's absence from the main anime storyline with his greater presence in the filler seasons. O_o

Originally Posted by Lia

Another greater illogical thing in the anime version is also the meeting with Bobasa. The anime so much ruined the interesting part about this guy. T_T Nowhere in the anime is mentioned that Bobasa is actually Shadi's servant - not just a key switch, haunting the Pharah's Memory World, that can lead the characters to where the Pharaoh's name is if thy give him enough food to eat. Nor even his slots of all the millenium items on his stomach were shown. T_T Also in the manga, he is actually Hassan, while they are different people in the anime. (If I'm correct about this fact though!?) The writers definitely made big mistake by depersonalizing Bobasa's character and when they belittled his role in the storyline.

Yes, I was also saddened by this. Bobasa was one of the most knowledgeable characters in the memory world, and could tell Yuugi and the others what they could and couldn't do in there. I can't remember whether he's different from Hasan in the anime, but I think he disappeared from in front of Yuugi and the others before Hasan appeared to protect the pharaoh? Like I said, I'm just not sure. Actually in the manga, Bobasa isn't *really* a servant of Shaadi but Shaadi himself, just like Hasan is, right?

Yes, it would have been far more interesting if the anime made clear that the stealing and the breaking of the puzzle along with the fire where Yugi had to solve the puzzle again were all created by Otogi's father who wanted revenge for the battle he lost agains Yugi's gradfather in the past. I guess the writers compensated Otogi's absence from the main anime storyline with his greater presence in the filler seasons. O_o

That's just sad. Besides which, the way Yuugi found out about the museum exhibit in the manga is much more logical. He's recovering in the hospital when another patient who sees his puzzle mentions the exhibit to him and shows him a newspaper article about it. In the anime, Malik was introduced too randomly. I've also always thought the way Bakura spoke to Yuugi in the anime, that night before they went back to the memory stone tablet, made absolutely no sense in the anime. There's no reason why Bakura would have revealed his plans, after all. Another thing I miss from the manga is the scene where Yuugi can't sleep (on the night when the god cards are stolen), and he and Atem have a little talk.

Originally Posted by PharaohAtem

Actually in the manga, Bobasa isn't *really* a servant of Shaadi but Shaadi himself, just like Hasan is, right?

As far as I know in the manga, Bobasa is actually Hassan, while they are different people in the anime. Shadi becomes Hassan only in the anime version. In the manga Shadi is Shadi. But I think I messed up the things with Bobasa by calling him Shadi's servant. I think it's most right to call him a member of an Egyptian cult that protects the Millennium Items. But I clearly remember Bobasa telling Jou and the others infront of the museum that he had served Shadi for many years and had come to protect Yugi by Shadi's orders. O_o This got a little bit complicated. xD

That's just sad. Besides which, the way Yuugi found out about the museum exhibit in the manga is much more logical. He's recovering in the hospital when another patient who sees his puzzle mentions the exhibit to him and shows him a newspaper article about it. In the anime, Malik was introduced too randomly. I've also always thought the way Bakura spoke to Yuugi in the anime, that night before they went back to the memory stone tablet, made absolutely no sense in the anime. There's no reason why Bakura would have revealed his plans, after all. Another thing I miss from the manga is the scene where Yuugi can't sleep (on the night when the god cards are stolen), and he and Atem have a little talk.

I'm sad we didn't have the chance to see "The Ancient Diaha" in the anime. This chapter was one of my most favourite moments in the manga's Memory World saga. Once again Kuriboh saved the day and gave Seto really good lesson about POWER. xD x)

Originally Posted by Lia

As far as I know in the manga, Bobasa is actually Hassan, while they are different people in the anime. Shadi becomes Hassan only in the anime version. In the manga Shadi is Shadi. But I think I messed up the things with Bobasa by calling him Shadi's servant. I think it's most right to call him a member of an Egyptian cult that protects the Millennium Items. But I clearly remember Bobasa telling Jou and the others infront of the museum that he had served Shadi for many years and had come to protect Yugi by Shadi's orders. O_o This got a little bit complicated. xD

Really? Dammit, then everything is getting confused because of the anime's way of handling it. >.< I don't know, but as far as Bobasa goes, even in the scans on Janime's site, doesn't he refer to himself as Shaadi's servant? And yes, that's the part I'm referring to when saying Bobasa himself made that claim.

I'm sad we didn't have the chance to see "The Ancient Diaha" in the anime. This chapter was one of my most favourite moments in the manga's Memory World saga. Once again Kuriboh saved the day and gave Seto really good lesson about POWER. xD x)

If you're referring to the duel of Atem and priest Seto, I'm not sure what you mean, since I don't recall seeing Kuriboh there at all. Speaking of things that should have properly been in the anime, there was the scene in the manga where, in the puzzle's maze, Yuugi feels anxious in front of a door and when he opens it, behind it is the memory of the fight against Kaiba at Duelist Kingdom. Instead, the anime replaced it with more Bakura nonsense.

Really? Dammit, then everything is getting confused because of the anime's way of handling it. >.< I don't know, but as far as Bobasa goes, even in the scans on Janime's site, doesn't he refer to himself as Shaadi's servant? And yes, that's the part I'm referring to when saying Bobasa himself made that claim.

He defined himself as Shadi's servant and a member of the Egyptian cult that protects the Millennium Items, which is actually lead by Shadi himself. That must be the most accurate definition. x)

If you're referring to the duel of Atem and priest Seto, I'm not sure what you mean, since I don't recall seeing Kuriboh there at all.

Well, the chapter is actually called "The ancient battle". It's with number 291, so you could just check in Janime's website for the RAW scans and the summaries. x)

Speaking of things that should have properly been in the anime, there was the scene in the manga where, in the puzzle's maze, Yuugi feels anxious in front of a door and when he opens it, behind it is the memory of the fight against Kaiba at Duelist Kingdom. Instead, the anime replaced it with more Bakura nonsense.

And I found for...strange...that the writers chose Haga and Ryuzaki to steal Yugi's god cards when in the manga the thief was some unknown guy "hired" by Dark Bakura. O_o This wasn't actually illogical, but was strange - at least for me. xD

Originally Posted by Lia

Well, the chapter is actually called "The ancient battle". It's with number 291, so you could just check in Janime's website for the RAW scans and the summaries. x)

You know, even though I remember reading that chapter one time (the first time when it was released) from you mentioning it now and seeing the scans again on Janime's site, I just did not remember its existence because its importance was lesser than the rest of the events in this arc. In a way, it's more of the usual testosterone contest between those two.

And I found for...strange...that the writers chose Haga and Ryuzaki to steal Yugi's god cards when in the manga the thief was some unknown guy "hired" by Dark Bakura. O_o This wasn't actually illogical, but was strange - at least for me. xD

Yeah, that was odd. Although is it mentioned that it's someone hired by Bakura? I just thought it was some random greedy guy who had participated in Battle City.

Millennium World's depiction in the anime is truly screwed up.

I would never recommend someone watching it until they saw the original telling of the manga because it gets so much canon dead wrong. In terms of narrative consistency and plot exposition, its about as bad as GX on a bad day. I have no idea who the writers were, but they just must've been high when they read Takahashi's manga story or something.

It seriously is horrible. I hate it.

Originally Posted by Makoeyes987

I have no idea who the writers were, but they just must've been high when they read Takahashi's manga story or something.

The one responsible for the Series Layout during the Pharaoh's Memory arc, as well as several of the episodes (specifically, 199, 200, 201, 202, 205, 206, 210, 214, 218, 222, 223, 224) was Shin Yoshida.

Yes, that Yoshida. You can go cry in the corners now. XD (Or you can cry on my shoulders, here.)

Originally Posted by Makoeyes987

Millennium World's depiction in the anime is truly screwed up.

I would never recommend someone watching it until they saw the original telling of the manga because it gets so much canon dead wrong. In terms of narrative consistency and plot exposition, its about as bad as GX on a bad day. I have no idea who the writers were, but they just must've been high when they read Takahashi's manga story or something.

It seriously is horrible. I hate it.

True, it isn't well done. But I can't condemn it nonetheless, since it animates my single favorite part of the manga and shows everything in beautiful colors. As long as one reads the manga beforehand, the anime is watchable. But then again, this is true of any manga series turned into an anime. Fillers are apparently unavoidable, as are changes. If an era comes when neither of these things will even be considered doable anymore, when they won't be acceptable at all, I'll be happy, but until then, I'm glad to see a good manga animated.

Originally Posted by PharaohAtem

Yeah, that was odd. Although is it mentioned that it's someone hired by Bakura? I just thought it was some random greedy guy who had participated in Battle City.

Well maybe I gave wrong interpretation to this scene. I don't know. I've always thought Dark Bakura made that guy to steal the god cards and the millenium items, but your point of view sounds me logical enough too.

Originally Posted by Makoeyes987

Millennium World's depiction in the anime is truly screwed up.

I would never recommend someone watching it until they saw the original telling of the manga because it gets so much canon dead wrong. In terms of narrative consistency and plot exposition, its about as bad as GX on a bad day. I have no idea who the writers were, but they just must've been high when they read Takahashi's manga story or something.

It seriously is horrible. I hate it.

When I first saw the Millennium World anime I loved it, it's what truely got me hooked on Yugioh..... and then I started buying the manga.... and that seriously opened my eyes!! I've not watched the anime since!!

Reading this thread has made me want to go and read it all again as it's been a while.

Originally Posted by Heather

When I first saw the Millennium World anime I loved it, it's what truely got me hooked on Yugioh..... and then I started buying the manga.... and that seriously opened my eyes!! I've not watched the anime since!!

The Millennium World Arc is definitely better in its manga version. It's way more detailed than the anime one, and the art is way cooler too. I like the anime version too (since I love the anime as a whole), but it would have been better if the writers hadn't changed so much the facts, depersonalized some of the characters and shortened such big part of the action. Not to mention the art should have been much better. Kagami had to do at least several episodes, especially after the awesome OP and ED for this final 5th season.

Originally Posted by Lia

Well maybe I gave wrong interpretation to this scene. I don't know. I've always thought Dark Bakura made that guy to steal the god cards and the millenium items, but your point of view sounds me logical enough too.

That should go on your list or mine, of questions to ask Takahashi should we ever get to meet him.

Originally Posted by Lia

The Millennium World Arc is definitely better in its manga version. It's way more detailed than the anime one, and the art is way cooler too. I like the anime version too (since I love the anime as a whole), but it would have been better if the writers hadn't changed so much the facts, depersonalized some of the characters and shortened such big part of the action. Not to mention the art should have been much better. Kagami had to do at least several episodes, especially after the awesome OP and ED for this final 5th season.

Yes, it is better, but the anime is definitely worth watching nonetheless. Some chapters probably should have made it into the anime though, like 291 that Lia just reminded me of.

Originally Posted by PharaohAtem

The puzzle thing bothered me a little more because of how glaringly stupid it was though. Also because I *hate* the way Otogi is introduced in the anime and that he didn't get to play the bigger part that he does in the manga.

The stupidest thing that arc did in the anime was that it completely marginalized Yugi. DDD was his time to shine, dammit. Also, I rather liked Dark Yugi's smaller but cooler part in the manga where he exposed Otogi's bar bet with Jonouchi.

And since this thread has turned into Stupid Anime Details: part deux, might I mention how utterly uncool Bandit Keith's ultimate fate in Duelist Kingdom was? I know ACME style pranks sort of fit with Pegasus' personality, but that trap door was just plain ridiculous.

Originally Posted by Dr_Watson

And since this thread has turned into Stupid Anime Details: part deux, might I mention how utterly uncool Bandit Keith's ultimate fate in Duelist Kingdom was? I know ACME style pranks sort of fit with Pegasus' personality, but that trap door was just plain ridiculous.

Lawl, me and Mako went through that in another thread a while ago. As we put it via comparing his punishments to his monsters: The trap door was like a Toon monster, "the gun to the head" Penalty Game was Thousand-Eyes Restrict.

While the manga version is much better, I still can't get over with the trap being fitting for Pegasus' personality, somewhat. Even if it was ridiculous and contrived. XD

In that scene's defense, however, Keith holding a gun to Pegasus' head > threatening Pegasus with a knife. Though, Pegasus holded both situations in an equally badass manner. Namely, staying calm with the gun at his head (anime) / telling his servants to hold their weapons, do a little speech then punish Keith for being a Jerk Ass (manga).

But if we are discussing stupid anime details again, I'll go and throw out Episode 28 again. Just... Episode 28. And people think things in GX and 5D's were ridiculous. Nothing beats the Fridge Logic / Mind Screw / What Do You Mean, It's Not Symbolic? / New Powers As The Plot Demands / All Just A Dream / Memetic Mutation of that episode.

Though, the tower climbing sequence with the blindfolded Bakura and Honda was priceless. And, well, it did give us some nice pan shots of Cyndia's portrait. That's always nice.

And I could go on for hours on Episode 40. :'| Or just leave this Wiki article link here.

Originally Posted by Arynis

Lawl, me and Mako went through that in another thread a while ago. As we put it via comparing his punishments to his monsters: The trap door was like a Toon monster, "the gun to the head" Penalty Game was Thousand-Eyes Restrict.

While the manga version is much better, I still can't get over with the trap being fitting for Pegasus' personality, somewhat. Even if it was ridiculous and contrived. XD

In that scene's defense, however, Keith holding a gun to Pegasus' head > threatening Pegasus with a knife. Though, Pegasus holded both situations in an equally badass manner. Namely, staying calm with the gun at his head (anime) / telling his servants to hold their weapons, do a little speech then punish Keith for being a Jerk Ass (manga).

But if we are discussing stupid anime details again, I'll go and throw out Episode 28 again. Just... Episode 28. And people think things in GX and 5D's were ridiculous. Nothing beats the Fridge Logic / Mind Screw / What Do You Mean, It's Not Symbolic? / New Powers As The Plot Demands / All Just A Dream / Memetic Mutation of that episode.

Though, the tower climbing sequence with the blindfolded Bakura and Honda was priceless. And, well, it did give us some nice pan shots of Cyndia's portrait. That's always nice.

And I could go on for hours on Episode 40. :'| Or just leave this Wiki article link here.

Yes, the anime does seem to like taking the more informative moments of the manga right out of the series. This is why for the important parts, I prefer the first series. The scenes with both Shaadi and Bakura were handled more closely to the manga.

I don't really remember episode 28 myself, since Duelist Kingdom is the least interesting arc to me. As for episode 40, I only remember it since you gave that link, and we can simply leave it at this: they should just have started the second series from volume 1 and then they'd have had no need for those useless filler seasons. The changes that did occur are simply too sad. Not to mention that the manga ending seems to explain the other Yuugi's consequent silent brooding a lot better.

Originally Posted by PharaohAtem

Yes, the anime does seem to like taking the more informative moments of the manga right out of the series. This is why for the important parts, I prefer the first series. The scenes with both Shaadi and Bakura were handled more closely to the manga.

I read the first 7 volumes of the manga, but I never really watched the Toei series. I think I saw the first episode only and the Toei movie.

And yes, it does. The evil intelligence of the Millennium Items was important, and they left that out. And they removed a lot of Mr. Crocketts' role. Then there was the awesome briefcase scene. |: And the Millennium Items punishing people not fit for them. And the paintings functioning as a TV screen for Pegasus to talk through were left out, too. Which is a pity, because that always made me think of Spaceballs and President Skroob getting into... unfortunate situations due to the screen placements.

I don't really remember episode 28 myself, since Duelist Kingdom is the least interesting arc to me. As for episode 40, I only remember it since you gave that link, and we can simply leave it at this: they should just have started the second series from volume 1 and then they'd have had no need for those useless filler seasons. The changes that did occur are simply too sad. Not to mention that the manga ending seems to explain the other Yuugi's consequent silent brooding a lot better.

Episode 28 kind of replaced the manga chapter where Honda decides to find Mokuba (basically what happens during the anime version of Yugi vs. Pegasus), and he runs into Bakura, guards get owned and whatnot. Episode 28 replaced it with a merry "let's climb this tower with animu logic and then we sank in a floor made of wine and oh shit Egyptian musical with chanting people and Gratuitous Christian Symbolism for the Rule Of Cool".

And yeah, exactly. I liked that part with Dark Yugi thinking about Pegasus and his deal. It also makes Pegasus' last act of telling his backstory even more awesome -- at first, Dark Yugi just demanded information from him, ready to punish him. Then as the backstory went on, he'd slowly change, feeling shocked and feeling sorry for Pegasus, and him thinking about himself and his origins in the end. But alas, the anime only gives you a Plot Hole-tastic diary which doesn't make sense. (Pegasus was confident Yugi wouldn't beat him, yet his diary states he had prepared it in case he is beaten. WTF?) Not to mention how everyone seems to arrive at the Sanctuary way before Yugi and co (even Crocketts and Saruwatari) despite the former being around the corner. That's some crazy teleport travel skills there. The manga made Pegasus' death even more shocking as well, because it came completely out of the blue. (The only clue in the manga was Bakura asking for the Millennium Eye replica from Yugi after the whole eyeball soup fiasco.) But nooo, we must have ANCIENT EGYPTIAN LASER BEAMS.

Though, the only thing that Episode 40 did better in my opinion was Pegasus receiving the Millennium Eye, at least as far as High Octane Nightmare Fuel is concerned. The manga made the process more ambiguous with only showing Shadi's men approaching Pegasus with a knife and the Eye, but the anime shows you Pegasus' eye being gouged out with his face having written pain all over it, then he screams, and then he's groaning and trying to get himself together. *shudders*

I admit I liked Bakura's little tarot, however. That interpretation of Pegasus[' life and personality] was interesting.

And yeah, starting the DM anime from the beginning would have solved a lot of things. It would have also given us a better presentation of the Toei episodes, namely no crazy neon coloring. (Personally I liked it, I thought it gave the anime some unique feel. XD) Readapting it would be the best, unfortunately card sales would be concerned, since DM doesn't really promote the newest sets.

Originally Posted by Arynis

And yeah, starting the DM anime from the beginning would have solved a lot of things. It would have also given us a better presentation of the Toei episodes, namely no crazy neon coloring. (Personally I liked it, I thought it gave the anime some unique feel. XD) Readapting it would be the best, unfortunately card sales would be concerned, since DM doesn't really promote the newest sets.

I'm adherent to the idea of remaking the entire DM series, rather than making new ones when 5D'S is already over. It would be cool to watch new DM anime whose plot sticks to the original manga. x)

Originally Posted by Arynis

[FONT="Tahoma"]I read the first 7 volumes of the manga, but I never really watched the Toei series. I think I saw the first episode only and the Toei movie.

If it weren't already too late, my advice would be to not watch the movie. But of the first series, the single most interesting episodes are 5-6 and 20-27. Ie the episodes that cover Shaadi, Kaiba and Bakura, in that order.

Episode 28 kind of replaced the manga chapter where Honda decides to find Mokuba (basically what happens during the anime version of Yugi vs. Pegasus), and he runs into Bakura, guards get owned and whatnot. Episode 28 replaced it with a merry "let's climb this tower with animu logic and then we sank in a floor made of wine and oh shit Egyptian musical with chanting people and Gratuitous Christian Symbolism for the Rule Of Cool".

Now I'm kinda happy I don't remember it...

And yeah, exactly. I liked that part with Dark Yugi thinking about Pegasus and his deal. It also makes Pegasus' last act of telling his backstory even more awesome -- at first, Dark Yugi just demanded information from him, ready to punish him. Then as the backstory went on, he'd slowly change, feeling shocked and feeling sorry for Pegasus, and him thinking about himself and his origins in the end. But alas, the anime only gives you a Plot Hole-tastic diary which doesn't make sense. (Pegasus was confident Yugi wouldn't beat him, yet his diary states he had prepared it in case he is beaten. WTF?) Not to mention how everyone seems to arrive at the Sanctuary way before Yugi and co (even Crocketts and Saruwatari) despite the former being around the corner. That's some crazy teleport travel skills there. The manga made Pegasus' death even more shocking as well, because it came completely out of the blue. (The only clue in the manga was Bakura asking for the Millennium Eye replica from Yugi after the whole eyeball soup fiasco.) But nooo, we must have ANCIENT EGYPTIAN LASER BEAMS.

I always disliked Duelist Kingdom in the anime for several reasons, but I think I'd like it a good deal more from reading the manga. Already there's an interesting scene after the Yuugi VS Pegasus TV duel. They're at school talking, with Yuugi himself being somewhat more ok with what happened (especially since he talks to his grandfather in the camera he's carrying around), but Yuugi mentions the other Yuugi is still upset over his loss. At one point Yuugi just gets up and says he wants to be alone, then clarifies that he's talking about the other Yuugi and not about himself.

Though, the only thing that Episode 40 did better in my opinion was Pegasus receiving the Millennium Eye, at least as far as High Octane Nightmare Fuel is concerned. The manga made the process more ambiguous with only showing Shadi's men approaching Pegasus with a knife and the Eye, but the anime shows you Pegasus' eye being gouged out with his face having written pain all over it, then he screams, and then he's groaning and trying to get himself together. *shudders*

LOL, you're a bit sadistic aren't you? ;P (j/k)

And yeah, starting the DM anime from the beginning would have solved a lot of things. It would have also given us a better presentation of the Toei episodes, namely no crazy neon coloring. (Personally I liked it, I thought it gave the anime some unique feel. XD) Readapting it would be the best, unfortunately card sales would be concerned, since DM doesn't really promote the newest sets.

Bah, you get used to the crazy coloring after a bit. Plus Kaiba gets the worst of that particular style. Since I don't like Kaiba to begin with, and the green of his hair just seems to enhance his craziness, I don't mind it all that much. I'm not sure what you mean about promoting the newest sets? The Toei series has practically no cards that are real except for a few monster and effect cards.

Originally Posted by Lia

I'm adherent to the idea of remaking the entire DM series, rather than making new ones when 5D'S is already over. It would be cool to watch new DM anime whose plot sticks to the original manga. x)

Other series have been redone before, and even older ones like Dragon Ball Z (Dragon Ball Kai is still airing in Japan). It's not impossible if they really want it. Keeping some of the more gruesome and/or controversial material, and adding in more explanations like in Duelist Kingdom, would make a much better anime. Not to mention it wouldn't feel like smoking crack for over half of the entire anime series...

Originally Posted by PharaohAtem

If it weren't already too late, my advice would be to not watch the movie. But of the first series, the single most interesting episodes are 5-6 and 20-27. Ie the episodes that cover Shaadi, Kaiba and Bakura, in that order.

Too late. XD

I liked the Toei movie on its own, though. I always liked it when Shogo pulled himself together after which Yugi finally summoned Red-Eyes, summoned Black Meteor Dragon and obliterated the three Blue-Eyes White Dragons. Hell yes.

Now I'm kinda happy I don't remember it...

Hahah.

I always disliked Duelist Kingdom in the anime for several reasons, but I think I'd like it a good deal more from reading the manga. Already there's an interesting scene after the Yuugi VS Pegasus TV duel. They're at school talking, with Yuugi himself being somewhat more ok with what happened (especially since he talks to his grandfather in the camera he's carrying around), but Yuugi mentions the other Yuugi is still upset over his loss. At one point Yuugi just gets up and says he wants to be alone, then clarifies that he's talking about the other Yuugi and not about himself.

I don't have the manga, but that's pretty interesting. On which note, the anime did have Sugoroku go into the TV, then another moment he's a card just like the Kaibas are. Whut. Magical transportation abilities much?

LOL, you're a bit sadistic aren't you? ;P (j/k)

That's an Understatement. a

I just thought it was good because it showed us how icky the Millennium Eye is in order to use it. Now, if they only kept the whole scene with the graverobber who stole the Millennium Ring. That was a great scene. I kind of liked the graverobber, too. Pegasus showing compassion over him was yet another moment that was sadly left out from the anime.

Bah, you get used to the crazy coloring after a bit. Plus Kaiba gets the worst of that particular style. Since I don't like Kaiba to begin with, and the green of his hair just seems to enhance his craziness, I don't mind it all that much. I'm not sure what you mean about promoting the newest sets? The Toei series has practically no cards that are real except for a few monster and effect cards.

You mean cabbage hair Kaiba? But I said, I liked the coloring style. XD

And by newest sets, I mean how the card game is advertised. Cohen put it the best in another thread:

Originally Posted by Cohen

What the target audience finds enjoyable has changed dramatically over 10 years. But more so, what target audience can find enjoyable enough to buy something has changed. While 10 years ago simply showing the game on TV would interest kids into the game, now you sorta have to integrate the advertising of real life packs and stuff into it. Notice how during Duel Monsters the card game had more monsters that didn't premier in the show, then during GX more started showing up in the show as they did in the packs. Now almost every card (monster at least) from the show shows up in a pack. Sure this is only for Japan atm (and possibly for a while until those 2 episodes a week catches 4kids up a bit) but that is clearly advertising packs. Advertising packs has been reserved for the commercials during Duel Monsters, but during GX and 5Ds it is very evidence to not be true anymore.

Basically, remaking Duel Monsters would be an issue from the Executive Meddling view that it doesn't promote the newest sets, which is (sadly) pretty much the main aim which the writers have to work with around. There's nothing stopping them from doing a remake, of course (they'd have to follow the manga, anyway), I'm just brining up this as a potential complication.

Originally Posted by PharaohAtem

Other series have been redone before, and even older ones like Dragon Ball Z (Dragon Ball Kai is still airing in Japan). It's not impossible if they really want it. Keeping some of the more gruesome and/or controversial material, and adding in more explanations like in Duelist Kingdom, would make a much better anime. Not to mention it wouldn't feel like smoking crack for over half of the entire anime series...

...But crack is good! And cheaper.

YGO (anime series) must stop being just an advertisement for new sets, decks, cards and so on. There's so much behind the "children's card game", but the writers don't seem to understand it. It's true the TCG brings money, but remaking the DM series by following the manga will be something right, not wrong.

The manga plot and the anime's transcendent animation combined together will create something unique. x)

Originally Posted by Lia

YGO (anime series) must stop being just an advertisement for new sets, decks, cards and so on. There's so much behind the "children's card game", but the writers don't seem to understand it. It's true the TCG brings money, but remaking the DM series by following the manga will be something right, not wrong.

The manga plot and the anime's transcendent animation combined together will create something unique. x)

I agree Lia. Some of my favourite parts to the manga was when Yugi had first solved the puzzle and blacked out when Dark Yugi took over so wasn't aware of the penalty games his alter ego was playing.

It's a shame in a way the card game got popular since Yugi never seemed to go back to all the other games he loved playing (it always made me smile when you saw him sat in the class playing pop up pirate - I think this was before he solved the puzzle and was only friends with Anzu). I'm not really that excitable about new cards played in the anime or mangas but I do like the character development and interaction so going back to the earlier manga when the Duel Mosters game wasn't in every episode would be like a dream come true to me.

Originally Posted by Lia

YGO (anime series) must stop being just an advertisement for new sets, decks, cards and so on. There's so much behind the "children's card game", but the writers don't seem to understand it. It's true the TCG brings money, but remaking the DM series by following the manga will be something right, not wrong.

The manga plot and the anime's transcendent animation combined together will create something unique. x)

Of course. There is much beyond the card game theme. I was just looking at the series from a different, corporate interests viewpoint. However, it's not (fully) the writers' fault. It's NAS' and Konami's, who gain their profit from the real life card game. The writers do understand it, why else do they bother with obscure alchemy and mythology love? (Or they are just angry geeks who entertain themselves with the references.) Also, look at the 10th Anniversary Movie, which is actually quite entertaining, despite the (Your Mileage May Vary) length. It shows they are capable of making great things, it's just that Executive Meddling screws the writers over. They have work with whatever they are handed. It explains why certain monsters get oddly shoehorned into the story (eg. Black Feather Dragon, the Nordic Gods). Then the writers struggle to fit the cards somehow into the continuity, with varying results.

The writers aren't perfect, of course. An episode could turn out to be hurka durka weird for varying reasons, be it failing to seamlessly integrate something into the story or leaving Fridge Logic behind (eg. support cards for the Signer Dragons). That's how I see it, anyway.

No excuses for altering parts of the original anime, however. Then again, we don't know why things were altered the way they were. It could have been once again Executive Meddling for whatever reason, the writers not wanting to adapt everything verbatim... The fillers were pretty much for letting the manga advance, despite their flaws and muck-ups. But yeah, this is a topic beyond my understanding. I'm merely guessing here.

Of course it would be a right thing to do. I'd kill for a proper adaptation of Duelist Kingdom to give justice to Pegasus and his arc. As well as the first seven volumes of the manga, and the Pharaoh's Memory arc. Well, pretty much everything.

Originally Posted by Arynis

Of course it would be a right thing to do. I'd kill for a proper adaptation of Duelist Kingdom to give justice to Pegasus and his arc. As well as the first seven volumes of the manga, and the Pharaoh's Memory arc. Well, pretty much everything.

There are plenty of moments from ALL manga volumes that should have been anime adapted, so yeah...pretty much everything indeed. x)
But speaking of anime's drawbacks compared with the manga, I would try to explain what are its assets in the same time (at least for me). x) But that will happen tomorrow, cuz I'll have to write VERY LONG post. xD

Millennium World needs a remake the most. No arc in the anime was as mangled and contorted as that one. Even though the first seven volumes of the manga were omitted, the way Millennium World was handled was as if the entire Millennium arc itself was just deleted.

Originally Posted by Arynis

Too late. XD

I liked the Toei movie on its own, though. I always liked it when Shogo pulled himself together after which Yugi finally summoned Red-Eyes, summoned Black Meteor Dragon and obliterated the three Blue-Eyes White Dragons. Hell yes.

*shrugs* Generally speaking, I prefer Red-Eyes to Blue-Eyes, but this might also have something to do with my dislike of Kaiba.

I don't have the manga, but that's pretty interesting. On which note, the anime did have Sugoroku go into the TV, then another moment he's a card just like the Kaibas are. Whut. Magical transportation abilities much?

Yeah, pretty in tune with each other's feelings, to that point. I'm pretty sure what I read was a scan from the english manga (just the weird way some things were worded, and the font used) though. Well, this is the place where I read the chapter, and they have right up to 65 (ie the beginning of the duel against Haga).

I just thought it was good because it showed us how icky the Millennium Eye is in order to use it. Now, if they only kept the whole scene with the graverobber who stole the Millennium Ring. That was a great scene. I kind of liked the graverobber, too. Pegasus showing compassion over him was yet another moment that was sadly left out from the anime.

If you ask me though, thinking of his eye being sliced out with a knife is a lot more gruesome. It's kind of ironic though, that a thief wasn't good enough for the ring that contains a thief.

And by newest sets, I mean how the card game is advertised. Cohen put it the best in another thread:
Basically, remaking Duel Monsters would be an issue from the Executive Meddling view that it doesn't promote the newest sets, which is (sadly) pretty much the main aim which the writers have to work with around. There's nothing stopping them from doing a remake, of course (they'd have to follow the manga, anyway), I'm just brining up this as a potential complication.

Oh, you meant newer versions of the same cards... About Kaiba's hair, I thought you meant you didn't like the neon-ness of the first series' coloring.

...But crack is good! And cheaper.

Crack like in episode 28 is bad though.

Originally Posted by Lia

YGO (anime series) must stop being just an advertisement for new sets, decks, cards and so on. There's so much behind the "children's card game", but the writers don't seem to understand it. It's true the TCG brings money, but remaking the DM series by following the manga will be something right, not wrong.

The manga plot and the anime's transcendent animation combined together will create something unique. x)

That's what the people who made the anime don't understand. They marketed this mostly at the wrong audience, and in the first place focused too much on the marketing to a point where it almost ruined the final arc of the anime. Well, if Dragon Ball Z could be remade, then so can Yugioh be. But the whole of it this time.

Originally Posted by Heather

I agree Lia. Some of my favourite parts to the manga was when Yugi had first solved the puzzle and blacked out when Dark Yugi took over so wasn't aware of the penalty games his alter ego was playing.

It's a shame in a way the card game got popular since Yugi never seemed to go back to all the other games he loved playing (it always made me smile when you saw him sat in the class playing pop up pirate - I think this was before he solved the puzzle and was only friends with Anzu). I'm not really that excitable about new cards played in the anime or mangas but I do like the character development and interaction so going back to the earlier manga when the Duel Mosters game wasn't in every episode would be like a dream come true to me.

Most of the cards are not very interesting to me either. Yuugi's and Atem's decks are the most interesting, and Pandora also had some interesting cards, but the others don't particularly interest me except for those dice cards Jonouchi has and his Red-Eyes Black Dragon (which I personally prefer to Blue-Eyes White Dragon). I also really liked some of the first few chapters of the manga. They were simple, not-so-innocent fun. After that, little aside chapters like the "date" were the most fun to read. Any chapters featuring interaction between Yuugi and the other Yuugi were always the most interesting to me.

Originally Posted by Arynis

No excuses for altering parts of the original anime, however. Then again, we don't know why things were altered the way they were. It could have been once again Executive Meddling for whatever reason, the writers not wanting to adapt everything verbatim... The fillers were pretty much for letting the manga advance, despite their flaws and muck-ups. But yeah, this is a topic beyond my understanding. I'm merely guessing here.

Of course it would be a right thing to do. I'd kill for a proper adaptation of Duelist Kingdom to give justice to Pegasus and his arc. As well as the first seven volumes of the manga, and the Pharaoh's Memory arc. Well, pretty much everything.

Even in the case of Dragon Ball Kai, the few filler episodes from Dragon Ball Z were left in, but filler seasons were not. That's the important part. If they remake Yugioh, it's ok to leave in the occasional wacky episode on crack, but just as long as they fully remove filler seasons that only frustrate the fans. And it's the important parts that mustn't be modified. For example, that part in the Duelist Kingdom manga produced more sympathy for Pegasus than its anime version, not to mention explained more about the other Yuugi's consequent search for his identity. The anime, on the other hand, just seems to jump into Battle City for no apparent reason without as much explanation. It appears as more of just "let's defeat the new bad guy" because of the treatment of the anime episodes that should have belonged to the Otogi arc but were delegated into more Malik nonsense instead.

Originally Posted by Makoeyes987

Millennium World needs a remake the most. No arc in the anime was as mangled and contorted as that one. Even though the first seven volumes of the manga were omitted, the way Millennium World was handled was as if the entire Millennium arc itself was just deleted.

Duelist Kingdom comes pretty close if you ask me. And nevermind the fillers. And that is the problem with the pharah's memory world arc. In the manga, the others make references to Monster World when thinking about some things. It's not just random things that jump out of nowhere. Even the "painful" door Yuugi opens, and in which he sees the scene of the duel against Kaiba in Duelist Kingdom, has meaning in that the maze of the puzzle is a test to all of them. The anime sort of glosses over the important parts such as these.

Originally Posted by PharaohAtem

*shrugs* Generally speaking, I prefer Red-Eyes to Blue-Eyes, but this might also have something to do with my dislike of Kaiba.

I had a Red-Eyes deck at a time, just because of that movie. Because I believed in Red-Eyes' "potential". XD Monarchs still blasted my rear, but it was a fun deck nonetheless. My last one before I gave up on the game, in fact.

Yeah, pretty in tune with each other's feelings, to that point. I'm pretty sure what I read was a scan from the english manga (just the weird way some things were worded, and the font used) though. Well, this is the place where I read the chapter, and they have right up to 65 (ie the beginning of the duel against Haga).

Ah, I see. Thanks for the link!

If you ask me though, thinking of his eye being sliced out with a knife is a lot more gruesome. It's kind of ironic though, that a thief wasn't good enough for the ring that contains a thief.

Yeah, true. But we still don't really see what happened. All we see is Shadow Discretion Shot, and then the Eye being in its place. I figured the knife could be also used to threaten him in case he still hesitated, not that it would be of too much use if the Millennium Item itself could kill the poor boy.

What would make it worse is if he had to cut out his eye with the knife himself. Augh.

Well, either way. Both versions are High Octane Nightmare Fuel with a good dose of Eye Scream. :|a

Oh, you meant newer versions of the same cards... About Kaiba's hair, I thought you meant you didn't like the neon-ness of the first series' coloring.

More like new cards in general. A new version of DM would pretty much "promote" old cards which have been released ages ago and/or are banned. But yeah, this is entirely from a marketing standpoint without taking anything else into consideration. A remake would cover more issues than this one. Another thing that crossed my thoughts, what about the voice actors? All of them? But yeah, not my department, so I'm not saying much.

And no, I do like it. I really do. XD

Crack like in episode 28 is bad though. :P

It depends, really. >D Despite one part of mine finding it ridiculous, the other one is like "YEEEEAAAH this is awsm guys". I mean, you could look it at as a group of robed people worshiping this elusive and mysterious woman. A++ BUb

Originally Posted by PharaohAtem

That's what the people who made the anime don't understand. They marketed this mostly at the wrong audience, and in the first place focused too much on the marketing to a point where it almost ruined the final arc of the anime. Well, if Dragon Ball Z could be remade, then so can Yugioh be. But the whole of it this time.

It could have been because GX was around the corner, which caused the last arc to be rushed. That's what the general consensus was around that time, if I remember right.

Even in the case of Dragon Ball Kai, the few filler episodes from Dragon Ball Z were left in, but filler seasons were not. That's the important part. If they remake Yugioh, it's ok to leave in the occasional wacky episode on crack, but just as long as they fully remove filler seasons that only frustrate the fans. And it's the important parts that mustn't be modified. For example, that part in the Duelist Kingdom manga produced more sympathy for Pegasus than its anime version, not to mention explained more about the other Yuugi's consequent search for his identity. The anime, on the other hand, just seems to jump into Battle City for no apparent reason without as much explanation. It appears as more of just "let's defeat the new bad guy" because of the treatment of the anime episodes that should have belonged to the Otogi arc but were delegated into more Malik nonsense instead.

Ah. Hrm. Thinking about it, the filler arcs could be left in in theory, if modified to fit with the original canon. Granted, that'd mess up Doma a big deal. Though, it has been said that Doma would make a great story on its own, rather than being integrated into the main plot of YGO.

And just a friendly advice, PharaohAtem, there's no need at all to split your replies, even when they get too long. Long posts aren't an issue at all, even if you're replying to several people. Especially in threads like this. ^^

Originally Posted by Arynis

I had a Red-Eyes deck at a time, just because of that movie. Because I believed in Red-Eyes' "potential". XD Monarchs still blasted my rear, but it was a fun deck nonetheless. My last one before I gave up on the game, in fact.

I don't know much about decks, just the cards that I like and don't like. Yuugi would kick my ass.

Ah, I see. Thanks for the link!

You do have to read a few pages into the chapter to get to that page, btw.

Yeah, true. But we still don't really see what happened. All we see is Shadow Discretion Shot, and then the Eye being in its place. I figured the knife could be also used to threaten him in case he still hesitated, not that it would be of too much use if the Millennium Item itself could kill the poor boy.

What would make it worse is if he had to cut out his eye with the knife himself. Augh.

Well, either way. Both versions are High Octane Nightmare Fuel with a good dose of Eye Scream. a

There's something to be said about leaving some things to the imagination. The anime version kinda bored me, to be honest.

More like new cards in general. A new version of DM would pretty much "promote" old cards which have been released ages ago and/or are banned. But yeah, this is entirely from a marketing standpoint without taking anything else into consideration. A remake would cover more issues than this one. Another thing that crossed my thoughts, what about the voice actors? All of them? But yeah, not my department, so I'm not saying much.

And no, I do like it. I really do. XD

Then we agree. ^_^ Though I wouldn't really call those new cards, more like new releases of the old cards, and possibly some new art on them. If the forbidden or banned cards weren't released the first time around, I doubt the standards will change enough for them to be released this time around. In Dragon Ball Kai, every voice actor that wasn't dead reprised their roles in Dragon Ball Z, with some possible exceptions that I'm not aware of. I don't think the voice actors would be a problem.

It could have been because GX was around the corner, which caused the last arc to be rushed. That's what the general consensus was around that time, if I remember right.

If that's true, then it's just sad. Especially considering what I hear people say about GX.

Ah. Hrm. Thinking about it, the filler arcs could be left in in theory, if modified to fit with the original canon. Granted, that'd mess up Doma a big deal. Though, it has been said that Doma would make a great story on its own, rather than being integrated into the main plot of YGO.

If they want to redo the anime, they should stick only to the manga though. Filler arcs would just ruin the flow of the manga, and I mean seriously, even the characters try to pretend none of that shit ever happened. Same thing with Dragon Ball Z. Those arcs were never referenced again, and I've seen the japanese episodes so I'm not just guessing at the dialogue and it's not a translation issue either.

And just a friendly advice, PharaohAtem, there's no need at all to split your replies, even when they get too long. Long posts aren't an issue at all, even if you're replying to several people. Especially in threads like this. ^^

I don't split most of them, even the long ones. I only split the extremely long ones because it gets a little confusing for me after a while anyway. Plus in cases like these, it's not such a big deal to double-post since it's not really double-posting. Replies simply get too long after a bit to remain a single individual huge-ass reply.

Originally Posted by PharaohAtem

I don't know much about decks, just the cards that I like and don't like. Yuugi would kick my ass.

Heheh.

You do have to read a few pages into the chapter to get to that page, btw.

*nods* Gotcha.

There's something to be said about leaving some things to the imagination. The anime version kinda bored me, to be honest.

That's true, of course. But in the end, they both have their strengths for different reasons, I s'pose. Though, the blood in the anime was total Narm. It looked like freaking ketchup. XD The whole vision scene was a lot better in the manga than in the anime, too, for tiny reasons here and there.

Then we agree. ^_^ Though I wouldn't really call those new cards, more like new releases of the old cards, and possibly some new art on them. If the forbidden or banned cards weren't released the first time around, I doubt the standards will change enough for them to be released this time around. In Dragon Ball Kai, every voice actor that wasn't dead reprised their roles in Dragon Ball Z, with some possible exceptions that I'm not aware of. I don't think the voice actors would be a problem.

Hmm, yeah. New art for the older cards would be pretty awesome, however, considering that some of them have a rather low quality art. I wouldn't call it low quality, just... relatively simple. (Not that there's anything wrong with that.)

Ah, I see.

If that's true, then it's just sad. Especially considering what I hear people say about GX.

While GX may have some offending flaws, the series can be quite enjoyable. There are several interesting characters and lots of obscure goodies hidden in the series. Though, GX is really just a Love It Or Hate It in this fandom. It's a pity, really, especially with all the flak it gets.

If they want to redo the anime, they should stick only to the manga though. Filler arcs would just ruin the flow of the manga, and I mean seriously, even the characters try to pretend none of that shit ever happened. Same thing with Dragon Ball Z. Those arcs were never referenced again, and I've seen the japanese episodes so I'm not just guessing at the dialogue and it's not a translation issue either.

*nod* Aye. I just said "in theory", though. I'm not saying they should be brought back again.

I don't split most of them, even the long ones. I only split the extremely long ones because it gets a little confusing for me after a while anyway. Plus in cases like these, it's not such a big deal to double-post since it's not really double-posting. Replies simply get too long after a bit to remain a single individual huge-ass reply.

Ah, okay. I remember you saying something along the lines of splitting your replies due to the length, though. I have nothing against it myself, it's just that some people here might be less accepting. ^^; So I thought I'd tell you, just in case.

Originally Posted by Arynis

That's true, of course. But in the end, they both have their strengths for different reasons, I s'pose. Though, the blood in the anime was total Narm. It looked like freaking ketchup. XD The whole vision scene was a lot better in the manga than in the anime, too, for tiny reasons here and there.

They probably just based it too much on fiction blood, aka how they use fake blood. And yes, I saw the comparing pics someone else posted for both versions of the vision. Or maybe I saw it on Wikipedia? Can't remember.

Hmm, yeah. New art for the older cards would be pretty awesome, however, considering that some of them have a rather low quality art. I wouldn't call it low quality, just... relatively simple. (Not that there's anything wrong with that.)

Well, things like Kuriboh are simple monsters. I think the monsters with the most details and nicest looks got all the high quality. On that note, ever noticed Yuugi doesn't precisely use any ugly or disgusting monsters?

While GX may have some offending flaws, the series can be quite enjoyable. There are several interesting characters and lots of obscure goodies hidden in the series. Though, GX is really just a Love It Or Hate It in this fandom. It's a pity, really, especially with all the flak it gets.

*shrugs* Rather than love or hate it, I'm just not interested in it.

*nod* Aye. I just said "in theory", though. I'm not saying they should be brought back again.

I understand, but I don't think we'd be doing a new series right, if it were to focus on manga plots only, by bringing in filler arcs that were only there to waste some time to begin with.

Ah, okay. I remember you saying something along the lines of splitting your replies due to the length, though. I have nothing against it myself, it's just that some people here might be less accepting. ^^; So I thought I'd tell you, just in case.

No prob. It's when my replies take up a little more than a full screen that I start to split them.

Originally Posted by PharaohAtem

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Well, this is the place where I read the chapter, and they have right up to 65 (ie the beginning of the duel against Haga).

Just look at the R manga scans. Aren't the scans very familiar to us ???

Originally Posted by Lia

Just look at the R manga scans. Aren't the scans very familiar to us ???

Sorry, I haven't read R yet, in what sense do you mean?

Originally Posted by PharaohAtem

They probably just based it too much on fiction blood, aka how they use fake blood. And yes, I saw the comparing pics someone else posted for both versions of the vision. Or maybe I saw it on Wikipedia? Can't remember.

You mean the manga-anime comparison link from the Janime Wiki I posted in the thread earlier. XD; While I did indeed make pictures for the vision, I haven't made a picture for the blood. (In actuality, some of the comparison pictures I made didn't make it into that page, because I couldn't fit every single picture in.) In the anime, it's a single Ketchup trail down from his Eye, while in the manga, he's holding his hand over his Eye, and you can see the blood squirting out a little.

Well, things like Kuriboh are simple monsters. I think the monsters with the most details and nicest looks got all the high quality. On that note, ever noticed Yuugi doesn't precisely use any ugly or disgusting monsters?

I didn't really mean the design of the monsters themselves, it's... hard to describe it. The coloring of the monsters in the earlier cards? Like the original Harpie Lady and Harpie Lady 1. Harpie Lady's card art looks more "simple" than Harpie Lady 1. And no, I'm not talking about the boobs here. XD It's like... the detail. Or something.

Though, a lot of the old cards' card art came directly from the manga, like Toon World. Manga Art | OCG/TCG Card Art

And yeah, Yugi doesn't use ugly monsters. Then again, he is an innocent kid who loves games -- both his Soul Room (his half) and deck reflects that.

*shrugs* Rather than love or hate it, I'm just not interested in it.

Fair enough.

I understand, but I don't think we'd be doing a new series right, if it were to focus on manga plots only, by bringing in filler arcs that were only there to waste some time to begin with.

Yeah, I know.

No prob. It's when my replies take up a little more than a full screen that I start to split them.

Gotcha.

Originally Posted by Lia

Just look at the R manga scans. Aren't the scans very familiar to us ???

Hah, TNKP scans! And scans by Janime / Cindy.

EDIT:

I have finished the Dungeon Dice Dragons arc in the manga. Definitely beats the possessed!Keith vs Yugi duel and it was an entertaining read. I liked the little plot with Yugi's grandpa and Otogi's father. But... the ending kinda bugs me.

How the heck did Jonouchi and Yugi survive in the fire? Okay, I know they were in a bad state and had to stay in hospital (especially Yugi), but... the building was literally on fire, it must have been very hot, and pretty much everything was engulfed in flames. Not even the firefighters were inside the building because it was in such a bad state. And there was a lot of smoke on top of it. How did Jonouchi make it out? Did the Puzzle protect him and Yugi? It just... never got addressed, apart from stating that Jonouchi suffered minor burns.

I know it was meant to be suspenseful and all, but yeah... am I missing something, or what? Or maybe it's just YGO being YGO, where we also have 17 year olds being genius game designers or company CEOs.

Originally Posted by Arynis

How the heck did Jonouchi and Yugi survive in the fire? Okay, I know they were in a bad state and had to stay in hospital (especially Yugi), but... the building was literally on fire, it must have been very hot, and pretty much everything was engulfed in flames. Not even the firefighters were inside the building because it was in such a bad state. And there was a lot of smoke on top of it. How did Jonouchi make it out? Did the Puzzle protect him and Yugi? It just... never got addressed, apart from stating that Jonouchi suffered minor burns.

I know it was meant to be suspenseful and all, but yeah... am I missing something, or what? Or maybe it's just YGO being YGO, where we also have 17 year olds being genius game designers or company CEOs.

Maybe they just got lucky? Happens in movies all the time. Hell, it happens IRL every once in a while. Although the idea that the Puzzle's magic somehow protected them is not that far fetched (as far as Fanwank goes :p), considering that Dark Yugi managed to reach out to Jonouchi, thus defying all previously established puzzle-logic.

The funny thing is, house fires generally don't melt metal, so the puzzle most likely would have been fine even if Yugi left it there after he assembled it. I imagine Otogi would have returned it, too, but that would have been far less dramatic.

Originally Posted by PharaohAtem

Sorry, I haven't read R yet, in what sense do you mean?

Originally Posted by Arynis

Hah, TNKP scans! And scans by Janime / Cindy.

Indeed! I don't think these scans must be there!

Originally Posted by Dr_Watson

Maybe they just got lucky? Happens in movies all the time. Hell, it happens IRL every once in a while. Although the idea that the Puzzle's magic somehow protected them is not that far fetched (as far as Fanwank goes :p), considering that Dark Yugi managed to reach out to Jonouchi, thus defying all previously established puzzle-logic.

The funny thing is, house fires generally don't melt metal, so the puzzle most likely would have been fine even if Yugi left it there after he assembled it. I imagine Otogi would have returned it, too, but that would have been far less dramatic.

Yeah, that's a good point. XD It just made me go "Huh?" for a moment there. Particularly because I'm not too familiar with fires. Personally I can't even stand being too near a bigger campfire for too long. A burning house would have done me in. @_@

I admit I found Yugi holding the Puzzle tightly while unconscious a little odd as well (since you can't really control yourself if you're unconscious...), but that was more believable due to Yugi being the Chosen One seeked out by the Puzzle three thousand years ago. So it may have been merely the Puzzle's and his bond to it doing it. Kind of like how the Eye was capable of brainwashing Pegasus, but instead the Puzzle made Yugi not let it go.

Do we know what material the Millennium Items were made from, exactly? (I still haven't found that page on Yugioh Mysteries, damn.) Apart from the human bodies, of course. Maybe it was a kind of metal that melted more easily, and thus shouldn't have been left in the fire? And even if it didn't, I guess Yugi couldn't have beared to get Dark Yugi roasted to smithereens.

Either way, thanks for the explanation, Watson!

The Millennium Items are made of gold.

Originally Posted by Makoeyes987

The Millennium Items are made of gold.

Yeah, in that case, it wouldn't have been a problem leaving the Puzzle behind. But as Watson said, it would have been less dramatic. And well, Yugi wouldn't have wanted to get his other half roasted, even if he would have been fine in theory.

Actually gold melts very easily, and is very malleable. While it is a dense pure metal, its also very easy to melt. Considering the intensity of the fire, it's very likely the pieces would've have melted or at the very least, warped where they would no longer be able to join together and thus become just hunks of gold metal. Leaving the puzzle would've been a very bad idea.

Yugi clutching the puzzle while unconscious doesn't strike me as odd at all, seeing as how its pretty common for some people when they faint or go unconscious to sometimes clutch things in a "death grip" if they were doing it before passing out. Sometimes the muscles rigidly lock during trauma.

Originally Posted by Makoeyes987

Actually gold melts very easily, and is very malleable. While it is a dense pure metal, its also very easy to melt. Considering the intensity of the fire, it's very likely the pieces would've have melted or at the very least, warped where they would no longer be able to join together and thus become just hunks of gold metal. Leaving the puzzle would've been a very bad idea.

Hm, yeah. The pieces would definitely warp, at least, which would render the Puzzle... uh. Millennium Hunk.

Yugi clutching the puzzle while unconscious doesn't strike me as odd at all, seeing as how its pretty common for some people when they faint or go unconscious to sometimes clutch things in a "death grip" if they were doing it before passing out. Sometimes the muscles rigidly lock during trauma.

I didn't know of that. (Yay for me failing Biology forever!) I assumed it would have been the total opposite, with your muscles loosening when you go unconscious, because you lose control over them. Though, that would imply it goes the same way with muscles locking, too.

Originally Posted by Arynis

You mean the manga-anime comparison link from the Janime Wiki I posted in the thread earlier. XD; While I did indeed make pictures for the vision, I haven't made a picture for the blood. (In actuality, some of the comparison pictures I made didn't make it into that page, because I couldn't fit every single picture in.) In the anime, it's a single Ketchup trail down from his Eye, while in the manga, he's holding his hand over his Eye, and you can see the blood squirting out a little.

Sorry, I don't tend to remember those things...

I didn't really mean the design of the monsters themselves, it's... hard to describe it. The coloring of the monsters in the earlier cards? Like the original Harpie Lady and Harpie Lady 1. Harpie Lady's card art looks more "simple" than Harpie Lady 1. And no, I'm not talking about the boobs here. XD It's like... the detail. Or something. Though, a lot of the old cards' card art came directly from the manga, like Toon World. Manga Art | OCG/TCG Card Art

And yeah, Yugi doesn't use ugly monsters. Then again, he is an innocent kid who loves games -- both his Soul Room (his half) and deck reflects that.

The boobs too. I think I still understood what you meant though, and I prefer the original art too. Also, it's odd that the card name changed. Oh, not just Yuugi, I actually meant the other Yuugi, since the deck of Battle City is mostly his. Even his darker monsters aren't ugly.

I have finished the Dungeon Dice Dragons arc in the manga. Definitely beats the possessed!Keith vs Yugi duel and it was an entertaining read. I liked the little plot with Yugi's grandpa and Otogi's father. But... the ending kinda bugs me.

How the heck did Jonouchi and Yugi survive in the fire? Okay, I know they were in a bad state and had to stay in hospital (especially Yugi), but... the building was literally on fire, it must have been very hot, and pretty much everything was engulfed in flames. Not even the firefighters were inside the building because it was in such a bad state. And there was a lot of smoke on top of it. How did Jonouchi make it out? Did the Puzzle protect him and Yugi? It just... never got addressed, apart from stating that Jonouchi suffered minor burns.

I know it was meant to be suspenseful and all, but yeah... am I missing something, or what? Or maybe it's just YGO being YGO, where we also have 17 year olds being genius game designers or company CEOs.

I always thought of it mostly as that they could get out because the door was clear. Also, adrenaline? I don't know. But it still remains infinitely better than the half-assed anime version.

Originally Posted by Dr_Watson

Maybe they just got lucky? Happens in movies all the time. Hell, it happens IRL every once in a while. Although the idea that the Puzzle's magic somehow protected them is not that far fetched (as far as Fanwank goes :p), considering that Dark Yugi managed to reach out to Jonouchi, thus defying all previously established puzzle-logic.

The funny thing is, house fires generally don't melt metal, so the puzzle most likely would have been fine even if Yugi left it there after he assembled it. I imagine Otogi would have returned it, too, but that would have been far less dramatic.

Assuming that the puzzle is pure gold, from what I've found online, gold could be melted by a house fire, and this was more like a total blaze. Remember this is the same metal that's too weak to be used for weapons. As for the other Yuugi and Jonouchi, I'll admit it surprised me a bit, but we'll have to add that to our list of questions for Takahashi.

Originally Posted by Makoeyes987

Yugi clutching the puzzle while unconscious doesn't strike me as odd at all, seeing as how its pretty common for some people when they faint or go unconscious to sometimes clutch things in a "death grip" if they were doing it before passing out. Sometimes the muscles rigidly lock during trauma.

I guess it's something like the stiffness of the dead.

Originally Posted by PharaohAtem

The boobs too. I think I still understood what you meant though, and I prefer the original art too. Also, it's odd that the card name changed. Oh, not just Yuugi, I actually meant the other Yuugi, since the deck of Battle City is mostly his. Even his darker monsters aren't ugly.

Oh, okay then.

The card name didn't change, it's just part of the Harpie Lady theme. The original Harpie Lady and Harpie Lady 1 are different cards (although the latter's ruling says its name is treated as Harpie Lady). Think of Harpie Ladies 1, 2 and 3 being the Harpies you see after Mai played Elegant Egotist, with Harpie Lady being the original one she played.

Yeah, that's true. Although I found the Anniversary art of Summoned Skull kind of hideous. It's not ugly, it's just... wicked. In both ways.

Originally Posted by Arynis

The card name didn't change, it's just part of the Harpie Lady theme. The original Harpie Lady and Harpie Lady 1 are different cards (although the latter's ruling says its name is treated as Harpie Lady). Think of Harpie Ladies 1, 2 and 3 being the Harpies you see after Mai played Elegant Egotist, with Harpie Lady being the original one she played.

I'm not sure what you mean since the character on the card looks exactly the same in both pics (only stylized differently), whereas the three Harpy Ladies all look noticeably different. And doesn't what you said about the ruling pretty much prove that the card is supposed to be the same?

Yeah, that's true. Although I found the Anniversary art of Summoned Skull kind of hideous. It's not ugly, it's just... wicked. In both ways.

It is hideous... Somehow the face is less detailed, and it almost looks like it has no face in this version. But that isn't Yuugi's fault, it's the fault of overachieving card game marketers.

Originally Posted by Makoeyes987

Actually gold melts very easily, and is very malleable. While it is a dense pure metal, its also very easy to melt. Considering the intensity of the fire, it's very likely the pieces would've have melted or at the very least, warped where they would no longer be able to join together and thus become just hunks of gold metal. Leaving the puzzle would've been a very bad idea.

Yugi clutching the puzzle while unconscious doesn't strike me as odd at all, seeing as how its pretty common for some people when they faint or go unconscious to sometimes clutch things in a "death grip" if they were doing it before passing out. Sometimes the muscles rigidly lock during trauma.

K, I could be wrong, but I've seen an untended house fire that burned/melted pretty much everything that wasn't jewelry. I'll agree that leaving anything precious in a fire is generally a bad idea, but leaving a magical lump of gold that remained intact for 3 millennia in a fire that was being tended to was slightly less of a bad idea than clutching it in a death grip, considering the circumstances. I mean, don't get me wrong, I thought that what Yugi did there was one of the most touching moments in the entire manga. I just think it goes against real world logic.

Slightly off topic - all this talk about the puzzle reminds me: was it ever confirmed that Yugi and Atem's soul rooms are inside the puzzle somehow? A lot of people seem to think so based on the Escheresque architecture, but I always figured that was a reflection of Atem's lost memories rather than the structure of the puzzle itself. IIRC, his "find my true soul room" challenge to Shadi was less of a dare and more of a "I have no clue where it is myself" sort of bluff.